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2005-08-11
Mos Grigore din Chicago (...@worldnet.att.net, IP: 208.207.43...)
2005-08-11 18:01
Ca vorbeam de China (2)

According to Lyle Goldstein, another Naval War College expert, diesel-electric subs have been able to operate for only two or three days on batteries, having to resurface to recharge them. With AIP, the submarine carries its own air supply, as it might extra fuel, and can recharge its batteries while deep underwater and stay submerged for two or more weeks.

"I don't think anybody really knows how far the Chinese are along with it, but we've found some very disturbing signs," Goldstein said.

According to Goldstein and Murray, the Chinese acquired much of their AIP technology from Germany. They emphasized that their assessments are their own and not official views of the Naval War College or the Navy.

All American submarines are nuclear; the Navy has no diesel-electric attack craft. Last fall, the Swedish government leased the Navy the use of one of its AIP-equipped diesel-electric vessels and crew so American anti-submarine warfare forces could train against the wider-ranging submarine tactics AIP makes possible.

As the Pentagon report on China observed, the U.S. has emphasized capability over quantity in maintaining its submarine fleet. But numbers give the Chinese certain advantages.

"Numbers matter," Murray said. "The Chinese obviously believe that numbers matter because they're turning out submarines like sausages. The Chinese are definitely on the winning end of an arms race."

Though the collapse of the Soviet Union decreased the need for the nuclear submarine as a globally deployed, second-strike nuclear deterrent, the U.S. underwater fleet still is spread worldwide as part of a strategy of projecting force on all oceans and major seas. That mission includes protection of the United States' wide-ranging carrier battle groups.

China is showing its new emphasis in other ways. It traditionally has been so focused on its army and ground warfare that for decades it had army generals commanding both its air force and navy. The new navy commander, Zhang Dingfa, is a navy admiral and veteran submarine officer.

Capitol Hill reaction

Alarm over the Chinese buildup is spreading on Capitol Hill. House Armed Services Committee Chairman Duncan Hunter (R-Calif.) argued that this was no time to cut back the size of the U.S. attack sub fleet or to close the Navy submarine base at Groton, Conn., as Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has recommended.

"The best anti-submarine weapon is another submarine," Hunter said.

The Pentagon report on Chinese military power assessed its submarine buildup as part of a coercive effort to persuade Taiwan that "the price of declaring independence is too high" and that naval action against Taiwan might include a blockade or outright attack.

"They want to deter us from interfering if they feel they have to use force to deter Taiwan [from independence], raising the potential cost [in sunk ships and casualties] of U.S. intervention to such a high degree that they think we will calculate we can't defend Taiwan without paying an exorbitant cost," Murray said.

Although Rumsfeld has raised concerns about China's military buildup, he has continued to state publicly that he believes the Taiwan dispute will be settled through peaceful negotiation.

"Our position with respect to Taiwan and the People's Republic of China hasn't changed in years," he said at a news briefing last month. "Our view is that whatever changes are to be made in that connection should be made on a peaceful basis by both countries."

"You judge military threat in two ways," said Marine Corps Gen. Peter Pace, who becomes chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff next month. "There're lots of countries in the world that have the capacity to wage war. Very few have the intent to do so. And clearly, we have a complex but good relationship with China. So there's absolutely no reason for us to believe there's any intent on their part."

"On the contrary," Tkacik said. "The Pentagon report shows that there is every reason to believe that China intends either to coerce Taiwan or to attack it. There is no third option."

geek-a-contra din lume (...@hotmail.com, IP: 63.239.35...)
2005-08-11 18:17
Re: so what?

sua are resurse tehnologice si financiare superioare, nu? sa-si faca si america submarine AIP in ritmul in care fac hotdogs.....


La 2005-08-11 18:01:28, Mos Grigore a scris:

> According to Lyle Goldstein, another Naval War College expert,
> diesel-electric subs have been able to operate for only two or three
> days on batteries, having to resurface to recharge them. With AIP,
> the submarine carries its own air supply, as it might extra fuel, and
> can recharge its batteries while deep underwater and stay submerged
> for two or more weeks.
> 
> "I don't think anybody really knows how far the Chinese are along
> with it, but we've found some very disturbing signs," Goldstein
> said.
> 
> According to Goldstein and Murray, the Chinese acquired much of their
> AIP technology from Germany. They emphasized that their assessments
> are their own and not official views of the Naval War College or the
> Navy.
> 
> All American submarines are nuclear; the Navy has no diesel-electric
> attack craft. Last fall, the Swedish government leased the Navy the
> use of one of its AIP-equipped diesel-electric vessels and crew so
> American anti-submarine warfare forces could train against the
> wider-ranging submarine tactics AIP makes possible.
> 
> As the Pentagon report on China observed, the U.S. has emphasized
> capability over quantity in maintaining its submarine fleet. But
> numbers give the Chinese certain advantages.
> 
> "Numbers matter," Murray said. "The Chinese obviously
> believe that numbers matter because they're turning out submarines
> like sausages. The Chinese are definitely on the winning end of an
> arms race."
> 
> Though the collapse of the Soviet Union decreased the need for the
> nuclear submarine as a globally deployed, second-strike nuclear
> deterrent, the U.S. underwater fleet still is spread worldwide as
> part of a strategy of projecting force on all oceans and major seas.
> That mission includes protection of the United States' wide-ranging
> carrier battle groups.
> 
> China is showing its new emphasis in other ways. It traditionally has
> been so focused on its army and ground warfare that for decades it
> had army generals commanding both its air force and navy. The new
> navy commander, Zhang Dingfa, is a navy admiral and veteran submarine
> officer.
> 
> Capitol Hill reaction
> 
> Alarm over the Chinese buildup is spreading on Capitol Hill. House
> Armed Services Committee Chairman Duncan Hunter (R-Calif.) argued
> that this was no time to cut back the size of the U.S. attack sub
> fleet or to close the Navy submarine base at Groton, Conn., as
> Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has recommended.
> 
> "The best anti-submarine weapon is another submarine,"
> Hunter said.
> 
> The Pentagon report on Chinese military power assessed its submarine
> buildup as part of a coercive effort to persuade Taiwan that
> "the price of declaring independence is too high" and that
> naval action against Taiwan might include a blockade or outright
> attack.
> 
> "They want to deter us from interfering if they feel they have to
> use force to deter Taiwan [from independence], raising the potential
> cost [in sunk ships and casualties] of U.S. intervention to such a
> high degree that they think we will calculate we can't defend Taiwan
> without paying an exorbitant cost," Murray said.
> 
> Although Rumsfeld has raised concerns about China's military buildup,
> he has continued to state publicly that he believes the Taiwan
> dispute will be settled through peaceful negotiation.
> 
> "Our position with respect to Taiwan and the People's Republic of
> China hasn't changed in years," he said at a news briefing last
> month. "Our view is that whatever changes are to be made in that
> connection should be made on a peaceful basis by both countries."
> 
> 
> "You judge military threat in two ways," said Marine Corps
> Gen. Peter Pace, who becomes chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
> next month. "There're lots of countries in the world that have
> the capacity to wage war. Very few have the intent to do so. And
> clearly, we have a complex but good relationship with China. So
> there's absolutely no reason for us to believe there's any intent on
> their part."
> 
> "On the contrary," Tkacik said. "The Pentagon report
> shows that there is every reason to believe that China intends either
> to coerce Taiwan or to attack it. There is no third option."
> 
> 
> 

Oriana din Italia (...@hotmail.it, IP: 213.140.17...)
2005-08-11 18:30
Re: Ca vorbeam de China (2) si ipotetica invazie a Taiwanului

le trebuie doar un pretext si o infuleca imediat


La 2005-08-11 18:01:28, Mos Grigore a scris:

> According to Lyle Goldstein, another Naval War College expert,
> diesel-electric subs have been able to operate for only two or three
> days on batteries, having to resurface to recharge them. With AIP,
> the submarine carries its own air supply, as it might extra fuel, and
> can recharge its batteries while deep underwater and stay submerged
> for two or more weeks.
> 
> "I don't think anybody really knows how far the Chinese are along
> with it, but we've found some very disturbing signs," Goldstein
> said.
> 
> According to Goldstein and Murray, the Chinese acquired much of their
> AIP technology from Germany. They emphasized that their assessments
> are their own and not official views of the Naval War College or the
> Navy.
> 
> All American submarines are nuclear; the Navy has no diesel-electric
> attack craft. Last fall, the Swedish government leased the Navy the
> use of one of its AIP-equipped diesel-electric vessels and crew so
> American anti-submarine warfare forces could train against the
> wider-ranging submarine tactics AIP makes possible.
> 
> As the Pentagon report on China observed, the U.S. has emphasized
> capability over quantity in maintaining its submarine fleet. But
> numbers give the Chinese certain advantages.
> 
> "Numbers matter," Murray said. "The Chinese obviously
> believe that numbers matter because they're turning out submarines
> like sausages. The Chinese are definitely on the winning end of an
> arms race."
> 
> Though the collapse of the Soviet Union decreased the need for the
> nuclear submarine as a globally deployed, second-strike nuclear
> deterrent, the U.S. underwater fleet still is spread worldwide as
> part of a strategy of projecting force on all oceans and major seas.
> That mission includes protection of the United States' wide-ranging
> carrier battle groups.
> 
> China is showing its new emphasis in other ways. It traditionally has
> been so focused on its army and ground warfare that for decades it
> had army generals commanding both its air force and navy. The new
> navy commander, Zhang Dingfa, is a navy admiral and veteran submarine
> officer.
> 
> Capitol Hill reaction
> 
> Alarm over the Chinese buildup is spreading on Capitol Hill. House
> Armed Services Committee Chairman Duncan Hunter (R-Calif.) argued
> that this was no time to cut back the size of the U.S. attack sub
> fleet or to close the Navy submarine base at Groton, Conn., as
> Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has recommended.
> 
> "The best anti-submarine weapon is another submarine,"
> Hunter said.
> 
> The Pentagon report on Chinese military power assessed its submarine
> buildup as part of a coercive effort to persuade Taiwan that
> "the price of declaring independence is too high" and that
> naval action against Taiwan might include a blockade or outright
> attack.
> 
> "They want to deter us from interfering if they feel they have to
> use force to deter Taiwan [from independence], raising the potential
> cost [in sunk ships and casualties] of U.S. intervention to such a
> high degree that they think we will calculate we can't defend Taiwan
> without paying an exorbitant cost," Murray said.
> 
> Although Rumsfeld has raised concerns about China's military buildup,
> he has continued to state publicly that he believes the Taiwan
> dispute will be settled through peaceful negotiation.
> 
> "Our position with respect to Taiwan and the People's Republic of
> China hasn't changed in years," he said at a news briefing last
> month. "Our view is that whatever changes are to be made in that
> connection should be made on a peaceful basis by both countries."
> 
> 
> "You judge military threat in two ways," said Marine Corps
> Gen. Peter Pace, who becomes chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
> next month. "There're lots of countries in the world that have
> the capacity to wage war. Very few have the intent to do so. And
> clearly, we have a complex but good relationship with China. So
> there's absolutely no reason for us to believe there's any intent on
> their part."
> 
> "On the contrary," Tkacik said. "The Pentagon report
> shows that there is every reason to believe that China intends either
> to coerce Taiwan or to attack it. There is no third option."
> 
> 
> 


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